Nepal Now: On the Move
We're talking with the people migrating from, to, and within this Himalayan country located between China and India. You'll hear from a wide range of Nepali men and women who have chosen to leave the country for better work or education opportunities. Their stories will help you understand what drives people — in Nepal and worldwide — to mortgage their property or borrow huge sums of money to go abroad, often leaving their loved ones behind.
Despite many predictions, migration from Nepal has not slowed in recent years, except briefly during the height of the Covid-19 pandemic. About 1 million Nepalis leave every year to work at jobs outside the country. Tens of thousands go abroad to study. Far fewer return to Nepal to settle. The money ('remittances') that workers send home to their families accounts for 25% of the country's GDP, but migration impacts Nepal in many other ways. We'll be learning from migrants, experts and others about the many cultural, social, economic and political impacts of migration.
Your host is Marty Logan, a Canadian journalist who has lived in Nepal's capital Kathmandu off and on since 2005. Marty started the show in 2020 as Nepal Now.
Nepal Now: On the Move
Migrant workers find love amidst struggles
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Today we’re back with another personal story—two in fact: those of Raj and Sunita. I gotta admit, what I like about this story is the romance element, which is something we haven’t heard from other guests so far. What they told us, when we recorded in the ACORAB studio in Chakupat, Patan, was that they were both working in Persian Gulf countries when a colleague suggested that they become Facebook friends. Sunita and Raj then chatted online for three years before finally meeting. You’ll have to keep listening to get the full story, but it does include chocolate, flowers and a very large spoon.
I’m having fun with this story, but I want to be clear about something—it’s not a fairy tale. Yes, Sunita and Raj found one another in what would seem like unusual circumstances to many of us. But there are millions of labour migrants worldwide, so I’m sure that many, many couples come together, like Raj and Sunita, while working abroad. Meanwhile, they experience life as migrant workers — the shock of living in a foreign country, without their language, food customs, and — especially — family, a family they might not get to see for years. They might face discrimination or mental, physical, and even sexual abuse, and there’s a chance that somewhere along the way, someone will try to cheat them out of their hard-earned money.
What I’m trying to say is that a migrant worker’s life is difficult, one that few people would choose if they had options. But except in the most extreme, harsh circumstances, their lives are multifaceted, like all of ours, and include pain, joy and yes, romance. And I hope this episode reveals a more fully rounded portrait of two migrants’ lives.
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Music by audionautix.com.
Thank you to Himal Media in Patan Dhoka for the use of their studio.
The first time we met he had brought some chocolates and fruits for me, but I didn't get to shop anything for him. So when he came I gave him my meal. I had cooked mushroom curry and then I gave it to him in a plate and a spoon. The spoon there is big like a ladle in Nepal. So he tells me that he threw away the plate but because he felt so loved towards the spoon that he has kept it. I think he still has it right. So she's asking him whether he still has the spoon. Yes, I still have it.
Marty Logan:Hi everyone. This is Marty Logan. Welcome to Nepal Now On the Move, the podcast where we talk with some of the huge numbers of people who are leaving this country every day, but also to the few who make the return trip to settle in their homeland. Today we're back with another personal story, two in fact, those of Raj and Sunita. I gotta admit, what I like about this story is the romance element, which is something we haven't heard from other guests so far. What they told us when we recorded in the Akerab studio in Chakupat, patan, was that they were both working in Persian Gulf countries when a colleague suggested that they become Facebook friends. Sunita and Raj then chatted online for three years before finally meeting. You'll have to keep listening to get the full story, but it does include chocolate, flowers and a very large spoon.
Marty Logan:I'm having fun with this story, but I want to be clear about something it's not a fairy tale.
Marty Logan:Yes, Sunita and Raj found one another in what would seem like unusual circumstances to many of us, but there are millions of labour migrants worldwide, so I'm sure that many, many couples come together like Raj and Sunita while working abroad. Meanwhile, they experience life as migrant workers, the shock of living in a foreign country. Shock of living in a foreign country without their language, food, customs and, especially, family, a family they might not get to see for years. They might face discrimination or mental, physical and even sexual abuse, and there's a chance that somewhere along the way, someone will try to cheat them out of their hard-earned money. What I'm trying to say is that a migrant worker's life is difficult, one that few people would choose if they had options, but except in the most extreme, harsh circumstances, their lives are multifaceted, like all of ours, and include pain, joy and, yes, romance, and I hope this episode reveals a more fully rounded portrait of two migrants' lives, raj and Sunita. Welcome to Nepal Now. Podcast.
Marty Logan:Raj and Sunita, welcome to Nepal Now. Podcast.
Marty Logan:Welcome to Nepal Now Podcast. Rajra Sunita, you are welcome to Nepal Now Podcast. I am welcome, thank you.
Speaker 3:Thank you too.
Marty Logan:Well, we're here today to talk about mainly your plans to go work overseas, but first, before we talk about migration and your personal migration stories, let's talk a little bit about your backstory, your histories. So I want to know where you were born, where you grew up, both of you. So maybe we can start with Sunita.
Heema Rai, interpreter:I was born in Hetoda and there have been a lot of difficulties in my life since I was born. I didn't get to study when I was 13,. I went to Kuwait for the first time as a 21 year old, so I faced a lot of hardship in my life, but now it's a bit okay. I got married and now my husband's home is in Cabri, so my husband's family is relatively a little bit off. But in my own home I still have to look after my family. I have my brothers, but still I do all the handling. My father died last year, so it's almost two years now, but still I have to look after everything over there.
Marty Logan:I'm very surprised to hear you say that you went to Kuwait when you were 13, but you passed as a 21-year-old. How did that happen?
Heema Rai, interpreter:So usually what happens is when we make our citizen certificate, we increase our age, right. So that's what I did when I was 13. I made my citizenship as a 20-year-old. Why I had to go was because my family, my parents, was in a very miserable condition. My brothers, my big brothers, small brothers they didn't do anything, and it was such a struggle that I had to go. I had no option left but to go abroad in that young age.
Marty Logan:I'm so surprised, and I think you must be very strong to have lived through that experience, so I don't really want to say congratulations. But that's very good on you that you, you did that and and you're, you know you're, we're here talking, I think. So over to Raj, let's hear a little bit about your story where you were born, grew up, that kind of thing.
Heema Rai, interpreter:So I was born in Kabre, Namobudda 2. My family life was also hard. I saw hardships since I was a little, but especially when my mom died when I was in grade 9. After that, our life became really difficult.
Marty Logan:Okay, and were you going to school until that time, until grade 9?
Heema Rai, interpreter:So I studied up to grade 11. I did my SAE school certificate from the village and came to Kathmandu but I couldn't study because it was so hard. And then I stayed in Kathmandu for three, four years and then went abroad. It was not an easy life.
Heema Rai, interpreter:So what I've understood is that life is struggle.
Marty Logan:And so when you came here, you finished your schooling and you started working for a few years. Then you went abroad. What kind of work were you doing here before you went overseas?
Heema Rai, interpreter:I didn't really work. in Kathmandu I didn't get to study like I already said. But I just stayed here in Kathmandu for three, four years and then went to Saudi. I stayed in Saudi for four years and then I came back but then. I had to go back again because I had invested in something the money that I brought back from Saudi but it all went to loss like the business didn't run, so I had to go back again.
Marty Logan:And then Sunita, you said you went to Kuwait. No, but I, if I am not mistaken, you met in Saudi, the two of you or no? How did you meet?
Heema Rai, interpreter:Yes, I was in Kuwait but then I came back to Nepal and then we went to Saudi again. We talked online, online for three years and then we met and ours was a love marries okay, so Sunita comes back from Kuwait yeah and then you had to go back to work because you needed a job, you needed to earn some money.
Marty Logan:When you came back the first time, did you think maybe you could stay in Nepal and find work here? Did you try to earn enough money here before going to Saudi?
Heema Rai, interpreter:So I came back to Nepal. But what would I do in Nepal? I had to look after my parents, so I went back abroad. When I was in Kuwait, things were not like this. Now there are phones, there's Wi-Fi and we can connect. But the first time I went there it was so difficult, like I couldn't even talk to my parents. If I had to talk to them, then I needed to use the madam's phone.
Marty Logan:Okay. So then you came home and then you decided you needed to go back and work. So you got another contract, this time in Saudi, saudi Arabia, right.
Heema Rai, interpreter:First time I went to Kuwait and stayed there for three years, then came back and stayed in Nepal for seven months and then I went to Qatar. So in Qatar, by my good luck or something, I had a Kerala madam when I was in Qatar.
Marty Logan:Sorry, you mean someone from Kerala, a woman from Kerala in India?
Heema Rai, interpreter:So she said that her madam was really good. She understood by her facial expressions when she was in pain or in need of money and she would always say, ok, it's not your salary time, but you can take this money as advance and then pay me back later. And she was so good I was really happy with her. She calls me even now. My mom had uterine cancer so I had to send all the money back home and I didn't have any savings, even in Qatar. So after staying four years in Qatar, I came back home, but again, like my family was the same, there was no support and I had to go back again and this time I went to Saudi. I met my husband. We talked for three years but sadly my father died. He died on 19th 18th and I came back to Nepal on 19th. I thought I would at least see the body of my father, even if I couldn't meet him, but they had already cremated him when I came back.
Marty Logan:Finally, the two of you were in Saudi Arabia and you said you talked online a lot, but how did you actually like the first time you made contact? Was it online, like Facebook, or did you actually meet in person the very first?
Heema Rai, interpreter:The first time we met, actually, we had a mutual connection. A sister that I knew also worked with this company. So they said that, oh, I know this person and they tried to set us up and we were like, oh, what happens if we only chat and become Facebook friends? It's harmless. So we actually added each other and then now we are here. We are now actually husband and wife. We talked for three years and now we've already been married for two years. So that's how we connected.
Marty Logan:Okay, that's great, but I still want to know a few more details. Okay, first, you talked by Facebook. How long before you actually met one another face-to-face?
Heema Rai, interpreter:So we continued talking online for two years and then it was my time to go back to Nepal and then, fortunately, they had my ticket and en route Dhamam to Nepal. So I went to Dhamam and that's where we met for the first time. I stayed in Dhamam for two years and then two days and then flew back to Nepal. Yeah, so he stayed in Aparva. Then it took a whole day for him to reach Dhamam that's where I worked. But
Heema Rai, interpreter:But at that point, after two years, you knew you wanted to meet her, not like a friend or like a friend. You must know after two years that you feel more than chatting friends, no?
Speaker 3:It was nice, it was good, it was all good.
Heema Rai, interpreter:Let's say it was all good and then, after a year of chatting, I had told my family that there's this girl that I'm talking with. That's what he said, and she's saying. The first time when we met in Saudi, it's not allowed for men and women to meet or even show faces, right? So when he came to my company, he stayed in a different room, a chamber, I stayed in a different chamber, and that's how we talked. So that was the first time how we met. Oh wow, that's a very different meeting.
Heema Rai, interpreter:The first time we met he had brought some chocolates and fruits for me, but I didn't get to shop anything for him. So when he came I had cooked mushroom curry and then I gave it to him in a plate and a spoon. The spoon there is big like a ladle in Nepal. So he tells me that he threw away the plate but because he felt so loved towards the spoon that he has kept it and I think he still has it right. So she's asking him whether he still has the spoon.
Heema Rai, interpreter:Yes, I still has it right so she's asking him whether he still has the spoon. Yeah, yes, I still have it okay, and then did you?
Marty Logan:did you leave together, like, did you quit your, finish your working at the same time or no?
Heema Rai, interpreter:no, we came back on different times. She came after one and a half years of me coming to Nepal.
Marty Logan:After you both returned here, you're both in Nepal. Did you know then you were going to get married? Was that already the plan?
Heema Rai, interpreter:So we had already planned it long back when we were in Saudi. He had already informed his family that I have this girl over here. So when we came to Nepal because we had already decided that we will get married so there's this thing called Kutumba in Tamang. They look at whether the girl and boy's caste within the Tamang community matches or not, and so, it had already been said, I came back to Nepal when my father died and after we finished all his funeral rites, then we got married.
Marty Logan:And how long ago was that now?
Heema Rai, interpreter:We've been married for two years and that's, I think, think how long I've had my tumor to write. So I apparently have a tumor on both sides of my uterus, so we didn't know if I could conceive or not, but now I'm pregnant. I'm actually two months pregnant, but I'm still in pain.
Speaker 3:But here we are.
Marty Logan:Well, congratulations. Thank you for coming. I didn't know that you had this obstacle, otherwise I might have said like we'll do it another time or something. So thank you very much for coming. This is a big news and very important thing for your family that you're pregnant. When we talked Raj, you said that you had started the process to go work in South Korea. I think that day we talked you had just finished your first exam, and then I think you mentioned also that Sunita was also planning to go to South Korea, that Sunita was also planning to go to South Korea. So can you explain that and update me on what your plan is now in terms of staying in the country or going to work?
Heema Rai, interpreter:It's only me who is planning to go to South Korea? I have an exam in December. Let's see whether I'll pass it or not. If I do, then I'm I will go there, but it's just me, not Sunita, at the moment.
Marty Logan:And so the exam is it a language exam or something Language exam? And how's your Korean now? Can you speak or just understand? Or how is it Just understand? Do you want to practice now? That's okay, we don't understand anyway, so no need. If you succeed in passing your exam, you go to Korea. Why do you want to go to Korea instead of Saudi or Malaysia or somewhere else? Saudi or Malaysia or somewhere else, oh Saudi Korea is relatively better than other countries.
Heema Rai, interpreter:We can also earn a little bit more, so let's say it's better than Gulf countries.
Marty Logan:And would the work be different than what you did in the Gulf countries? The type?
Heema Rai, interpreter:of work In Saudi, I went as a driver In Korea. It's a manufacturing job in a company so I don't know what I'll have to do.
Marty Logan:And I might have got this detail wrong also, but I think you told me when we talked before that if you succeed and get this working visa for Korea, it's for 10 years.
Heema Rai, interpreter:Before it was five years, but now it's been 10 years of visa.
Marty Logan:So you could be living and working in Korea for 10 years.
Heema Rai, interpreter:It's possible, I have to. I don't see anything in Nepal.
Speaker 3:It's very hard to find a decent job here, so I have to.
Marty Logan:Let's say you could do the same kind of job that you're doing in South Korea. So let's say in South Korea you're working in a company making doors. Let's just say, for example, if you could find the same job here in Nepal, also making doors, would you stay in Nepal to do the job or would you still go overseas?
Heema Rai, interpreter:Obviously I would go out, because in Nepal there's no earning.
Marty Logan:So even if you could get a job here, the money would just be much, much less than in South Korea or another country.
Speaker 3:The money is the least in.
Heema Rai, interpreter:Nepal, in Gulf countries it's okay, but some people earn really a lot.
Speaker 3:But in South Korea it's much better.
Heema Rai, interpreter:If I could, I would go to other big countries better.
Marty Logan:If I could, I would go to other big countries, and how do you feel if he goes away and you're staying here with your children?
Speaker 3:let's say, how do you feel?
Heema Rai, interpreter:about him not being around. It's okay, I don't have any problem, I've planned that once he goes abroad, then I'm not going to stay in Kathmandu, I'm going to go back to Kabri. There also they have private boarding schools, there are bus and everything. Here I will be all alone but there I have family.
Marty Logan:There are some people who say that by not providing jobs for the people, the young people especially, the Nepal government is not living up to its promises, is not doing a good job. To put it simply, how do you feel about the fact that you have to leave the country to earn your living? Is that okay, or are you sad or angry, or how do you?
Heema Rai, interpreter:feel about that Of course it feels really sad, really bad, that I have to leave my country, that I have to live apart with my family.
Heema Rai, interpreter:It's really bad like so many young people are sacrificing their lives to earn some money abroad. And it's, the situation out there is so bad, like recently in Dubai. They sentenced somebody, a Nepali, to death and they've appealed so much to be saved. But how can his father collect two crore within a week? It's not simply possible In Kuwait, for example. If my partner, if my friend, is sick, I cannot even touch her. So the situation is so bad out there. But we have no other option. No parent, no father or mother, wants to send their children to such a dire situation. But we have no other option. We have to send them. And the situation in those countries is not like here. That's not our home, that's not our country. So it's really bad, but we have no option other than to go in such a bad situation. But we have no option other than to go in such a bad situation. If our government could even provide a job which pays 30,000 regularly, monthly, then we wouldn't have to go.
Marty Logan:but there's no such job out here, Okay, last question Do either of you have any friends or anyone in your family, young people like you, who manage to make a living here in Nepal, who have a good job working in Nepal?
Heema Rai, interpreter:We have nobody in either side of our family who has a good job or earning good money. Everybody is outside His family. Even his uncles are still working abroad. Not even in our friend circle, even our whole village. Most of them are abroad. So we don't know anybody who has a good job and income in Nepal and who's staying in Nepal.
Marty Logan:OK, we have to end it there. The time is up. Thank you again very, very much for doing this. I really appreciate it and best of luck to both of you and your family. I hope your family is very big with your work, with your life in general, thank you. Thank you to Hima Rai, whose voice and laugh you heard throughout this episode and who did an amazing job of interpreting from Nepali. Thanks again to the Association of Community Radio Broadcasters of Nepal for the use of their studio.
Marty Logan:Please let me know what you thought of this episode. Please let me know what you thought of this episode. Email me at napalnowpod at gmailcom, or message the show at napalnowpod on Instagram, linkedin, youtube or Facebook. Send us a text by clicking on the link at the top of the episode description. If you know any migration couples, tell us about their stories. Next week, you'll hear a new micro-episode of Nepal Now, right Now. Do you know any migration couples? Tell us about their stories. Next week you'll hear a new micro episode of Nepal Now, right Now, with updates about the show and about migration's impact on Nepal. I'll talk to you then. Thank you.
