Nepal Now: On the Move
We're talking with the people migrating from, to, and within this Himalayan country located between China and India. You'll hear from a wide range of Nepali men and women who have chosen to leave the country for better work or education opportunities. Their stories will help you understand what drives people — in Nepal and worldwide — to mortgage their property or borrow huge sums of money to go abroad, often leaving their loved ones behind.
Despite many predictions, migration from Nepal has not slowed in recent years, except briefly during the height of the Covid-19 pandemic. About 1 million Nepalis leave every year to work at jobs outside the country. Tens of thousands go abroad to study. Far fewer return to Nepal to settle. The money ('remittances') that workers send home to their families accounts for 25% of the country's GDP, but migration impacts Nepal in many other ways. We'll be learning from migrants, experts and others about the many cultural, social, economic and political impacts of migration.
Your host is Marty Logan, a Canadian journalist who has lived in Nepal's capital Kathmandu off and on since 2005. Marty started the show in 2020 as Nepal Now.
Nepal Now: On the Move
Pragati Nepali plans to further her design career by migrating to work in Jordan
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Pragati Nepali is just 19 but already she has been married, migrated to work in neighbouring India, and then moved to Nepal’s capital Kathmandu for other opportunities. That’s where friends told her about a job in a garment factory in Jordan. When we talked last week she estimated that she might be finished her paperwork and winging toward the Middle Eastern country by mid-December.
Jordan is one of very few Middle Eastern countries to which the Government of Nepal allows women to migrate for work. That’s because of past incidents of violence against women migrant workers in the region’s countries. We talked about this ban earlier this year in our chat with expert Sadikshya Bhattarai. The flow of migrant workers from Nepal to Jordan has never been huge, peaking at just over 2,700 in 2016-2017 and then falling to just 621 in 2022-23. Regardless, tens of thousands of women have made the trip to other countries in the region illegally, often being trafficked through India. We spoke with one such woman, Sushma, earlier this year.
Pragati says an aunt working in Jordan encouraged her to apply for a job in the factory, which reportedly makes clothing for Nike and other brands. Pragati has already set out a path after she completes her three-year contract in Jordan: she will return to her home district, Mugu, and start a design business.
Resources
- Nepal labour agreement with Jordan, 2017
- Flow of migrant workers from Asia to Jordan
- Previous episode — Women migrant workers from Nepal: Lift the ban and get positive
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Music by audionautix.com.
Thank you to Himal Media in Patan Dhoka for the use of their studio.
I've already lived in India and I've seen a different culture and I adjusted there pretty well. So I feel like it won't be that hard for me to adjust in Jordan.
>> Marty:Pragati Nepali is just 19, but already she has been married, migrated to work in neighbouring India and then moved to Nepalals'capital Kathmandu for other opportunities. That's where friends told her about a job in a garment factory in Jordan. When we talked last week, she estimated that she might be finished her paperwork and winging toward the Middle Eastern country by mid December. Welcome to Nepal. Now on the Move. My name is Marty Logan. This is the podcast that talks to some of the tens of thousands of people migrating from and sometimes two, this small country surrounded by global giants, China and India. Months later, we reach out again to find out if reality in their new temporary home is meeting expectations. Occasionally we call in an expert to try and better understand all of this movement. Jordan is one of very few Middle Eastern countries to which the government of Nepal allows women to migrate for work that'because of past incidents of violence against women migrant workers in the regions countries. We talked about this ban earlier this year in our chat with expert Sadiksha Batra. The flow of migrant workers from Nepal to Jordan has never been huge, peaking, uh, at just over 2,700 in 2016-2017 and then falling to just 621 in 2022 23. Regardless, tens of thousands of women have made the trip to other countries in the region illegally, often being trafficked through India. We spoke with one such woman, Sushma, earlier this year. Pragati says an aunt working in Jordan encouraged her to apply for a job in the factory which reportedly makes clothing for Nike and other brands. Pragati is already set out a path. After she completes her three year contract in Jordan, she will return to her home district, Mugu, and start a design business. Please listen now to my chat with Pragati Nepali Pragati Nepali welcome to Nepal. Now on the Move podcast.
>> Pragati Nepali:Uh, thank you sir.
>> Marty:Uh, we're here to talk about your upcoming trip to Jordan. You're going there to work. But before we talk about that, can you tell me a little bit about your early life? Where you were born and grew up, where you went to school and while you're very young still. I know you're not even 20 yet, but all of the things up until. Nowi uh, pragatiiamaste my name is Pragati
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:I was born and brought up in Ablis in Mugu west till class 8 I studied in a local school, Bhar School for my grades 9 and 10. I then went to a bigger school_ali school. But then during that time I left my studies.
>> Marty:Okay. And do you have brothers and sisters? Uh.
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:Yes. I have one elder sister and I have three younger siblings.
>> Marty:Do you mind telling me why you left school? Uh.
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:I got married immediately after my SLC (school leaving certificate) or after Grade 10 And then I had to, uh, take a gap year. But then my relationship, my with my husband was not very good. So things happen. And I suddenly found myself in that situation where I dropped out of school. And then my relationship also fizzled out. That's why I am looking forward to going abroad because I have to do something of my life. I thought.
>> Marty:So you got married and then, uh, were together with your husband for a while, but it didn't work after that. Did you study some more? Did you start working? I know that you took a fashion design class or something like that.
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:Got married and my relationship with my husband got strained, I started thinking about what I could do. I had already left my study, so I could't or I didn't want to go back to school. And then I always had an interest in fashion designing. So as I was working on something else, I also started taking this fashion designing classes. Um, needless to say, I didn't have support of my husband and my parents. Of course, um, they were not in a position to help me because I was already married. So despite the hardship, I continued to do the fashion designing classes while I was also working for something else. Because it's also, it was also a kind of my passion.
>> Marty:So all of this time you were still in Mugu? Where exactly in Mugu are you in the same place as your parents or where you did your SLC or where were you living?
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:I was no longer with my parents. Once I got married, I stayed with my husband for almost a year. And then both of us went to India and that is where I did the uh, fashion designing course. So I was taking the course for almost three months. But then we had some problems. It was not a problem from outsider or anybody. The problem was, uh, between us two, our relationship. So then I came back to Nepal and I stayed with my parents for about three months in Nepalans. And I continued to do the course, uh, the fashion designing course. But things were not, uh, very good, um, with my parents also. I got a little bit frustrated and I felt like, okay, I have to do something more, not, uh, not just sit around. So then I came to Karmandu and then I worked in a garment for about five, five or six months. And then I got this current job. So I shifted to Kata and I was working there. But then my work visa to Jordan is uh, almost here and I quit my job at KATA and I'm free these days.
>> Marty:And just one more thing about your backstory, if we can call it that. When you went to India with your husband, that was just to get work, to make money. I'm assuming.
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:We had some problems back at home also. So both of us wanted to earn some money. So we went to India just for that. To find uh, some work, some job, just to find, earn some money.
>> Marty:So you've had these short times of work experience in different places. What kind of skills would you say that you have now? Like do you have skills in design or in making clothes or like how would you describe your skills and then also what interest you have after doing that work experience? Like did you find that by doing this you really took an interest in designing clothes or maybe something else?
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:The first work I did was in a wool factory where I learned to make, uh, manyi wool items like toys, flowers, dolls and etceter. And it was all done in hand, so it was all handicraft. And I learned that, uh, talking about India, I was working in this pressure, um, gifts company. But then I was also taking fashion designing classes. So there I learned everything from tailoring or sewing to designing, cutting. Um, I can do designs and I can do cutting, but the most I enjoy is sewing. Actually tailoring. I really love tailoring. I found.
>> Marty:Were you actively looking for a chance to go work outside of Nepal or did you just hear about an opportunity and apply because it sounded interesting.
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:Uh, I hadn't even thought about that. When I came to Kathmandu, I just wanted to work in fashion designing because, um, that was my passion. So when I came here I thought I would complete my course first and then work in this field. But then I got in contact with my old friends back from Mugu who were abroad and they started saying, oh, there's this job, there's this position for you which is perfect for you. And then they started to convince me and that's how I actually learned that there are such jobs abroad. And that's how I got into this.
>> Marty:So now tell us everything about this job you're going to get. What is it? What will you be doing? How big a place is it? What exactly are you making? Explain it all to us.
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:The country I'm going to is Jordan. I don't know what place in Jordan or what city in Jordan exactly. But the company that I'll be working for is apparently called Zia. And it's a garment factory there. Um, they do all kinds of thing, tailoring, packaging. And my work over there will be that of checking or quality control.
>> Marty:Okay, and so you said you heard about this from your friends. Uh, how many friends are there and how long have they been there? Are they happy? Is everything going really well there? I'm guessing yes, because they're still there. Ah. What have they told you about the place?
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:My friends, uh, report that the job is not as hard as, um, sometimes it is made to sound like. Uh. And they said that it is really safe, especially for ladies, because there's all these safety measures for us and we are very, um, very well taken care of. And they say that we only have to work eight hours a day. And, uh, they have really good policies to protect their workers. So I've heard only good things from my friend. And there are a lot of my friends who are working over there. But right now I'm, uh, in active contact with only one of my friend who works over there.
>> Marty:Will you be living in a do like a dormitory, a big space with many women in the same building or room? Do you know exactly how that works?
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:As far as I know, there are separate, uh, rooms for us. The room, I've heard, accommodates about four to five people. So I will probably be sharing a room with four or five other colleagues or female staff. And I've heard that. But they provide us like separate bath and separate wardrobes and separate, uh, furnitures for all of us so that we can adjust our staff and accordingly. And the friend who I am in contact with, um, they also live in a hostel similar to where I'll be residing. But their hostel and workplace is a bit farther away. But I've learned that the hostel I'll be staying in and our workplace is.
>> Marty:The people in the, uh, factory. Are they all women or is there a mix of men and women?
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:No, it's all women. It's all women in the company. And my friend is also a female. We are similar in ace, but by relationshipsis actually my aunt.
>> Marty:Do you know exactly how long she's been there?
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:It's only been three or four months.
>> Marty:Do you know what exactly they make? If it's sewing, it must be some sort of clothing. Do you know what market it's for where it's sold.
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:They make uh, these ready made garments that we are all wearing right now. So like hoodies for both ladies and gents. I don't know about other brands but uh, what I know is that uh, one of the client is Nike but I don't know where the market is, where they send the garments.
>> Marty:Do you already have all of your documents like your ticket, your visa? Have you done all the necessary uh, health tests? China.
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:So I've already finished my medical and my visa is being processed. I still have to do the orientation but some of the friends who applied along with me, some of them already have their visa and they are having orientation this Sunday and Monday. But uh, for me and some of the other people, I think they are processing our visa in Bash. That's why some of us haven't received the visa. But I'm pretty sure that within eight to 10 days we will also receive the visa and we'll be doing orientation and within the next 10 days or so.
>> Marty:So overall, how are you feeling about going? Are you happy? Nervous mixture, uh, of things You said you're not exactly sure where Jordan is. Obviously it's a long way away. It's a different country, culture, it's all going to be very new. How are you feeling about that?
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:Regarding Jordan being a new, unfamiliar place for me, I've already lived in India and I've seen uh, a different culture and I adjusted there pretty well. So I feel like it won't be that hard for me to adjust in Jordan or anywhere else in the world. But regarding feelings I don't know what to say. I'm neither happy nor excited, nor nervous or scared. But if I really listen close to my heart, I think I'm almost sad because I'll be leaving my parents, I'll be leaving my family members. I'll be leaving my home and going to such a faraway place. But then if I listen to my mind, it says we have to face any kind of situation that life throws at us. We have to adjust just accordingly. So if I listen to my brain, this is what I have to do with my life right now. It's a mixed, mixed bag.
>> Marty:You mentioned leaving your mother and father behind. And I've met your sister. I know she's here. How are your family and friends who are here? What are they saying to you? Is everyone saying it's a great opportunity and go or are some people saying stay? Uh, what's the feedback you're Getting.
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:You know how, ah, us young people are. Everybody is excited to go abroad. So my friends just say, oh, it's going to be a good opportunity for you for future, so just go. But with my parents, there are a be reserved talk in circles. They say, oh, if it's good for you, uh, if you have ve decided this is what you want to do with your life, if you feel like this is going to make your future better, then you can go. But you can also stay. But they haven't forced me not to go or they haven't said like, you can't go. They are open to it, but they just want to make sure that this is something that's good for me. So that's their reservation. Otherwise, they've also kind of given me permission to go.
>> Marty:When you think about going, I know you told us earlier that your contract will be for three years. How do you imagine this is going to change your life? Um, like you're no longer in your village, you're no longer in Kathmandu. You're going to Jordan. So let's say you stay in Jordan for three years. What happens then? Do you think that you'll come back to Nepal and go back to your village, come back to Nepal and open a business? Or maybe after Jordan, you find another country to go to. How do you imagine things will happen?
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:Uh. Um. I am taking this, uh, three years as an opportunity to learn and improve my craft or my skill in fashion designing. So I want to learn as much as I can in this, uh, three years. And after I come back to Nepal, I don't plan to go to another country. I also don't really plan to stay in Kathmandu. I actually want to go back to Mugu and start my own small fashion designing outlet or something over there. I hope I will learn enough in Jordan so that I can start my own business here.
>> Marty:Of all the people you grew up with who were roughly your age in your village and in your school, how many are still in Mugu and kind of living there full time? Or how many are in Kathmandu or how many left the country?
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:I don't exactly know where my classmates are or my friends are. Um, I couldn't say. Especially those I studied, um, with in grade nine and 10. But the people I grew up with in my village I think five or at least five or six of them have already, uh, got married and they are still in the village Some two or three, I think have come to Kathmandu. Uh, so far as I know, only one, my aunt that we just talked about, only she has gone abroad, but I'm not really sure because after I see, we just scatter around and I would really not stay abreast of my friends
>> Marty:Just your best guess. When do you think you'll be going? When will all your administrative work be done and you'll get your ticket and you'll be going? A Couple of weeks? 1 month, 2 months?
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:It's not been confirmed yet, but, uh, I estimate that I'll be flying out by the end of this month. So maybe two weeks from now. I don't know exactly, but since the friends or colleagues who applied with me, they are getting their visa and I see how it's going. So I think it will pretty soon be my turn.
>> Marty:So no more questions from me. But is there something else you want to say that you didn't have a chance to say, or do you have any questions along the way? Life, uh.
>> Interpreter Heema Rai:Uh, if I just have to express myself freely, I have a lot of experience. Even though I'm young, I have experiences before I got married, when I was married, and then after I left my husband. But in my life, there are more sad moments than happy moments. But yeah, I don't know, uh, whether I should tell them all or not. I just have a lot of stories. That's all I want to say.
>> Marty:So next time you can tell us all your stories. Thank you very much for coming and talking uh, to us today. And uh, I hope everything goes very smoothly and you have successful time in Jordan Thanks again to Pragati Nepali for chatting with me. Let us know what you thought of her story. You can send a text by clicking on the link at the top of our show notes or message us on social. We're at Nepal Now Pood on LinkedIn, Facebook and Instagram. You can also email us at nepalowpod(at)gmail.com. Thank you again, to Heema Rai for her excellent interpretation of Pragati's words. I'll talk to you next time.
